Verb pattern + modal

Обсуждение вопросов, нюансов и тонкостей грамматики английского языка любого уровня.

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gavenkoa
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#1

Сообщение gavenkoa »

Allow is used with to:
He allowed me to take a book.
On other hand I found myself writing:
Should we allow entering cryptic expression?
I think that modal verb changes rules of a game and following doesn't sound to me:
Should we allow to enter cryptic expression?
One extra: entering is a noun in my mind: добавление / ввод. Probably it is an actual reason to allow gerund after "allow" and there is nothing to do with modals?
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#2

Сообщение Yety »

gavenkoa пишет: 08 май 2019, 11:16 Allow is used with
TO-infinitive or gerund: ADVISE, RECOMMEND, ALLOW, PERMIT, FORBID, REQUIRE
gavenkoa пишет: 08 май 2019, 11:16 Should we allow SOMEONE to enter cryptic expression?
gavenkoa пишет: 08 май 2019, 11:16 entering is a ... добавление / ввод - gerund after "allow" and it has nothing to do with modals
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#3

Сообщение gavenkoa »

[mention]Yety[/mention] Thanks for pointing about mandatory OBJ in case of infinitive: SUB + allow + OBJ + to + V1.

I haven't put enough attention to that.
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#4

Сообщение tourist »

gavenkoa,
Sorry to barge in.
You might as well ignore my post completely
but rather than stuffing your head with nonsense like
mandatory OBJ in case of infinitive: SUB + allow + OBJ + to + V1.
you would be better off spending your time learning English.

Watching the efforts you put into studying grammar books instead of actually learning the language,
I really feel sorry for you,mate.
Sure,grammar is important and it is an indispensable part of language,
but I think you should get your priorities right.

A well-known "expert" on this very board,who's been studying grammar and dictionaries for 20+ years
and who's still unable to write a decent sentence in English should not be your role model.
There are countless beginners who've been brainwashed indoctrinated into believing this Grammar-is-the-King idea,
but you're not a beginner anymore and should know better by now, buddy )
That's my honest opinion.
Use it,don't use it.

following doesn't sound to me = Runglish for 'не звучит'
use instead : it doesn't sound right to me/grates on the ear

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#5

Сообщение Easy-Breezy English »

tourist пишет: 08 май 2019, 13:53 There are countless beginners who've been brainwashed indoctrinated into believing this Grammar-is-the-King idea,
Isn’t that the truth!
However, we should probably keep in mind that not everybody has the advantage of using the language in the natural environment. Often learners simply have no other choice but to go down this winding grammar road. Just to make some sense of English. Don't you think?
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#6

Сообщение tourist »

Easy-Breezy English,
are you sure you want to open up this can of worms ? )

Whatever environment is available to a learner, extensive reading and listening/watching
will beat any boring grammar book hands down any time.
I'm not denying the need for grammar.
I'm talking about proportions and priorities regardless of the environment.
So there. )
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#7

Сообщение Easy-Breezy English »

Oops, I might have made a вброс or whatever it's called... Unintentionally, though. Me and my big mouth...
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#8

Сообщение tourist »

Easy-Breezy English пишет: 08 май 2019, 16:34 Oops, I might have made a вброс or whatever it's called... Unintentionally, though. Me and my big mouth...
you,being a beginner on this forum is hereby forgiven.)
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#9

Сообщение Роман Молти »

Easy-Breezy English пишет: 08 май 2019, 16:34 made a вброс or whatever it's called
The closest thing to "make a вброс" I can think of is "sneak in a rage bait". Actually, I'm struggling to find another appropriate English equivalent. "Sneak in" is for situations in which a person does it on the sly. I'd use "slip in" a rage bait when one does it unintentionally.
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#10

Сообщение tourist »

rage bite is good.

let me try to coin a new VERB for to "make a вброс" similar to "to google"
to ¿¿¿¿¿¿¿¿¿¿¿¿¿¿¿ a post
or
to regardless a post
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#11

Сообщение Easy-Breezy English »

Роман Молти пишет: 08 май 2019, 16:51 The closest thing to "make a вброс" I can think of is "sneak in a rage bait". Actually, I'm struggling to find another appropriate English equivalent. "Sneak in" is for situations in which a person does it on the sly. I'd use "slip in" a rage bait when one does it unintentionally.
To the best of my knowledge, there's no such word in English that would be commonly used. "Rage bait" seems fairly obscure. "Trolling" is what it's normally called, but that has to be intentional. I think tourist has already used the best idiom here - "to open a can of worms".
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#12

Сообщение Роман Молти »

Easy-Breezy English, fairy nuff.
Nice picture, btw
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#13

Сообщение Chaika »

I agree with post#4 by tourist. As a native speaker, I was never taught rules like mandatory OBJ in case of infinitive: SUB + allow + OBJ + to + V1 in English class. These are the kinds of things you learn by reading and talking.
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#14

Сообщение Alex2018 »

Post-predicate to-clauses:
verb + NP + to-clause
It enables [the farmer] to maintain uniform and near constant conditions in the house.
Post-predicate ing-clauses:
verb + NP + ing-clause
Wen you see [a geek] walking down the street, give it a good throw.
Don't be surprised to find [me] sitting on the tee in the lotus position.
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#15

Сообщение Easy-Breezy English »

You are all completely wrong, all of you. This is how it REALLY goes:

Изображение

And while we are on the subject of grammar, you should NEVER end a sentence with a BIRD.
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#16

Сообщение tourist »

Easy-Breezy English,
you should NEVER end a sentence with a BIRD
on the other hand flipping the bird is perfectly acceptable )
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#17

Сообщение Easy-Breezy English »

LOL
As I was typing "bird", I thought for sure someone was going to think of flipping the bird, but then I hoped for the best... Was I ever wrong. :-))
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#18

Сообщение gavenkoa »

Chaika пишет: 08 май 2019, 20:07 I was never taught rules like mandatory OBJ in case of infinitive: SUB + allow + OBJ + to + V1 in English class.
Recently I completed 12 hour (3 week) English class where we studied "Introductory verbs". Our coursebook (Virginia.Evans - Grammarway, book 4) had table similar to:

Изображение

https://7esl.com/introductory-verbs-reported-speech/

Previously I was taught "verb pattern" with similar table (much simpler as I was on Elementary level).
Chaika пишет: 08 май 2019, 20:07 These are the kinds of things you learn by reading and talking.
Paid tutors didn't tell me that, I figured that out partly with help of EFL.RU ))
tourist пишет: 08 май 2019, 13:53 Watching the efforts you put into studying grammar books instead of actually learning the language
Today I finished Elementary coursebook )) Tomorrow I'll start Pre-Intermediate. It took me half year ((

Actually I've read only "Introduction" sections in my Grammar books. I've completed only 30 first topics of red Merphy (the most elementary).

I write sentences as they go in my mind, without any analytical thinking. The only exception I do is during proofreading business related written text.

My education (mathematician) reveals love to structural explanations. But we know that intuition cannot be replaced with millions of static facts ))
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